North American Network Operators Group

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Re: Internet2

  • From: Vicky Rode
  • Date: Fri Apr 29 20:51:24 2005

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Hi,

comments in-line:


Dan Hollis wrote:
| On Wed, 27 Apr 2005, Randy Bush wrote:
|
|>to source is still the big gap.  imiho, from the ops perspective,
|>only sally's ecn has made any useful approach.  sadly, we may be
|>able to judge the actual demand for e2e qos by ecn's very slow
|>deployment.  i think this is unfortunate, as ecn is pretty cool.
- -------------
yeah ecn make sense to us as well. We are currently looking at piece
mealing this deployment at our end.

fyi - I think kernel.org has also implemented ecn at their end.

|
|
| The low demand is partially due to IWF[0] who unwittingly block it. Many
| OSes deploy with ecn support but default it off due to the IWF problem.
- -----------
True enough. Plus devices (by default) may not honor CE (congestion
experienced) bits and hence could become non compliant end node which
could result in an unnecessary packet drop in the network.


|
| And there are so many IWF that applying enough cluebats to clear the path
| for ECN is going to take enormous effort.
|
| We could demonstrate how cool ECN is, if there werent so many IWF making
| this impossible. Entities who try to deploy ECN are deluged with "hey wtf
| I cant reach site XYZ anymore, your shit is broken, fix it you *******!"
|
| I have no idea if microsoft supports ECN yet, but if they dont then I
| suspect that a sufficiently embarassing benchmark would prod them into
| adding it.
|
| I wonder how many network operators on nanog block ECN. If you do, why?
- ------------
In fact I raised similar point at NANOG33 in two separate sessions (How
to Use Network Design Principles to Differentiate the Good, the Bad, and
the Ugly AND IP Fast-Reroute: An Analysis of Applicability to a Core
Network) about vendor experience/feedback in this area. Didn't get much
feedback.



regards,
/vicky

|
| -Dan
|
| [0]Idiots With Firewalls. See http://urchin.earth.li/cgi-bin/ecn.pl
|
|
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