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Re: UltraDNS - are there any brain cells left?

  • From: Matt Ghali
  • Date: Tue Nov 01 01:54:39 2005
  • Domainkey-signature: a=rsa-sha1; s=pants;; c=simple; q=dns;b=u5axMECLUYMP9L7fSt3eZRaqNU2S5DJbxSsWR4/FHD/UwMWSsvih94JHBM4bpmElVC1HkJPckAOFj/7UdWwNcA==

On Mon, 31 Oct 2005, Rodney Joffe wrote:

  As one of the remaining idiots, allow me to respond to you 
  initially here on NANOG - albeit 2 weeks later after being on the 
  road at NANOG and ARIN.

Thank you for acknowledging my presence as a customer. I had a brief 
bout of (mis)communication with your support staff, but 
communication abruptly ended two weeks ago. Oddly enough, I sent in 
a ping to them this afternoon. 

  You're obviously hoping that posting an inflamatory note in a 
  public forum will get you more action from UltraDNS, or will help 
  show the world how clueful you are.

Inflamatory? Wow. Have you met Mr. Kettle, Dr. Pot? I am thrilled 
that UltraDNS is fine with you disclosing customer data in public.

Having lost all hope in getting a useful response from support, 
nanog was my last hope of getting the attention of someone clueful 
down there at UltraDNS. Unfortunately, it seems, I got your 
attention instead.

  Either way, so be it. If you want to follow up to this, do so by 
  emailing me privately. The list already has way too much noise 
  from home cable and dsl users with zero responsibility for real 
  networks of any significance.

I agree! Your representation of UDNS is much better reading than all 
those darn kiddies. You _are_ representing UDNS, right? You do seem 
to have access to proprietary customer data.
  Perhaps you could provide a snippet of this empirical evidence - 
  perhaps logs of any successful zone transfers from your master to 
  any UltraDNS slave that was achieved via use of TSIG?

The boat I'm in was caused by a double-disk failure. Not 
surprisingly, I lost logs as well as config.

  There have been 3,900 transfers so far into UltraDNS from your 
  various masters that have occurred successfully without the 
  benefit of a TSIG key, starting on the day (October 9, 2002) that 

Well, that's surprising. From the day I obtained service from, I configured both the tsig key they provided me, as 
well as covering allow-transfer address ranges "just in case".

  UltraDNS voluntarily took responsibility for the 5,000 odd free 
  accounts that the original Nominum provided under, 
  and that UltraDNS has continued to provide at no charge. On that 
  day, a large number of users (many of them on NANOG) 
  responded properly to the UltraDNS emailed instructions, and they 
  have successfully been doing zone transfers using TSIG.

Are you suggesting that I am not a paying UDNS customer? You don't 
come out and say it, since that would be a lie- but you do a great 
job of casting aspersions.

  That's because you cannot configure TSIG zone transfers within the 
  UltraDNS UI - TSIG transfers occur to a dedicated set of TSIG 
  servers within UltraDNS, and as all users of TSIG within UltraDNS 
  know, the UltraDNS UI then shows the IP address for transfers as 
  the dedicated UltraDNS TSIG axfr servers, *not* those of the 

That's great- but you know as well as I do that the keys were from (Nominum) and not UDNS. Thanks for the hand-waving, 

  I think that you have us confused with some other provider of 
  yours. Our logs and system confirm that your free 
  domains (such as have *never* been transferred to 
  UltraDNS using TSIG, but have always been done using normal axfr.

What about my paid-for domains, Rodney? I think you have me confused 
with another customer. 
  Uh, you obviously mean someone else. UltraDNS has never used your 
  TSIG key to do transfers for, as far as I can tell. Once 
  again, do you have any records of any TSIG transfers to us?
  > Earlier this year, I lost the key
  > when my nameserver had a nasty double-disk failure.
  H'mmmm. Forgive me for being confused - this was whose stupidity 
  and lack of brain cells? The lack of backups of critical data like 
  TSIG keys, etc?
Could you take a break from publically insulting your customers, and 
confirm that you have a grasp of what happens when both sides of a 
mirrored pair of disks die within 3 hours of each other?

  Our TSIG servers (they are different machines to our normal axfr machines)
  have audit trails back to October 9, 2002. There is no record of your zone
  having ever been configured within them.

It is surprising to me, and quite dissapointing, that UDNS did not 
continue authenticating zone transfers via TSIG, like 
  Nope. We have never transferred data from you to our TSIG servers. 
  So we have never had a key for that domain, or the zone it is in.

Sorry, you're plain wrong. I had a tsig key from Nominum. If UDNS 
lost them in the transition, then it really isn't my bad. What part 
of UDNS blowing it is my fault?

  Whatever. I get the feeling that NANOG (from 11 or 12 years of 
  participation) is not the best place for folks to work out their 
  personal issues that require rants.
  Rodney Joffe
  Apparent Brainless Dolt

I get the feeling a lot of folks have a vastly different opinion of 
your employer, as well. Thanks for the assistance!  

matt ghali

[email protected]<darwin><
              The only thing necessary for the triumph
              of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke