North American Network Operators Group
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Re: ULA and RIR cost-recovery

  • From: Pekka Savola
  • Date: Wed Dec 01 01:43:01 2004 
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004, Owen DeLong wrote:

[snip a bunch of stuff where we finally appear to basically agree or at least
understand each other]

Actually, that fragmentation was primarily the result of being
insufficiently stingy early on.

There are many kinds of fragmentation.  When you only get (e.g.,) a v4
/24 for a start, and when you need more, you'll have to get a new
non-adjacent /24, there's going to be fragmentation.


I don't think you can equate v4 /24 allocation to v6 /48 allocation.
A /48 gives an organization 65,536 unique subnets, each of which can
accomodate enough hosts that _EVERY_ IPv4 possible host can have
4+billion addresses.
I was not referring to /48's -- that's sufficient for end-sites. I was referring to giving less than /32 or the like for ISPs, and _that_ causing fragmentation of advertisements because the _ISPs_ would have multiple prefixes.

There is no need to be unusually stingy about the prefix lengths given to the ISPs.

It's not as we are carving out v4 /8's (1/256 of space) for early
adopters. Or even /16's.  More like the equivalent space of a host
address.  That's hardly too much.  In fact, it's way too little for those
ISPs which have home customers like DSL, and it's going to be a a pain
because they either must get a new prefix or give their customers a /64
instead of /48.


I think that if an ISP can show that they have more than 65536 home DSL
customers, they will not have a problem getting a /31 or larger as needed.
However, I think that today, the bulk of DSL ISPs doe not have that many
customers and aren't likely to in the near future.
Uhh, I'd say there are a thousand or two such ISPs in the world. That's not insignificant. It isn't useful to be stingy when allocating prefixes to ISPs which _might_ end up needing more than a /32 for their customer /48 assignments.

And if such ISPs decide that rather than going through the process of justifying more space, they end up giving the customers /64's instead.. well, the result might not be pretty.

--
Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the
Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds."
Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings