North American Network Operators Group

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Re: Lack of Security

  • From: Barton F Bruce
  • Date: Thu Sep 13 02:34:37 2001

Not that this has anything to do with NANOG, but ...

Why be limited to just AN air marshall?

Allow some already licensed citizens to carry their own handguns on planes
after running them through some sort of civilian air marshall program -
maybe run by the National Guard at high school level or earlier for the
future members to get a headstart, and by the FBI for those actively on

For those in the program who don't choose to carry all the time off the
planes,  provide issue weapons that get turned in at the far end for those
coming with none, and provide checking/storage at either end for those more
comfortable their own but perhaps not wanting a weapon with them at some
business meeting.

Yes, you may lose a plane or two through screwups or until training and
screening get refined, but far better hundreds in the unlucky plane than
thousands when buildings or sports stadiums or monster urban cryo-LNG tanks
are successful targets. Its not that the terrorists would be personally
afraid of these civilians, but they would be rightly afraid their success
rate would be severely crimped.

If all the passengers of the planes this week were aware of what was really
about to happen, I suspect the outcome would have been a lot different. If
you are apt to be dying anyway, make sure the bastards don't get their way
totally. One plane apparently did that.

But if you then tilt the scale towards the public's side a bit more than
hand to hand combat with a knife (or gun or bomb) wielding terrorist allows,
and add a few civilian marksmen you have a much safer plane that I would not
mind flying on.  Go to your local gun club and watch the local police come
for their annual requalifying now that they need a properly lead proofed and
ventilated range the city/town can no longer afford, and then watch the
average club member shoot. On average, guess who is the better shot by far!

This juncture should not be one where the public is further disarmed, but
should be one where Americans, even those that don't like guns, should
seriously consider learning to use them well if and when needed, and should
be demanding more of their rights to self defense be returned.

And give them bonus frequent flyer miles or special discounts, and a
Saturday of intense training every 3 months or so that they even get paid to
attend. Make the system popular, but demand some serious training.

And don't whine about Columbine and guns and school kids. Normal American
kids and guns are fine. Some quality instruction helps. I grew up in a
neighborhood in Cambridge Mass where all the kids had access to guns and
could shoot as much as they could afford. Noone got hurt. One of the Harvard
Professors ( ) across
the street owned marsh islands off the north shore and the neighborhood kids
took turns being his kid's guests. You could shoot all you wanted but had to
bring or pay for your own ammo. Handguns, rifles, and shotguns. That was in
the early 50s and I was pretty young as we moved away from there at the end
of my 7th grade. I was a lucky city kid with access to instruction and
shooting space. Country kids will all laugh because they always had such
access. We didn't have garbage TV back then and more important did not have
prescription psych mind-rape drugs being pumped into school kids as a bad
crutch or source of Federal $$s by school systems that have wandered far
away from real teaching ability. Keep the psychs and their
Columbine/Wakefield style drugs OUT of schools and certainly out of any
civilian air marshall program and you can have a safe system.

----- Original Message -----
>From: "Dave Stewart" <[email protected]>
>To: "Mathias K�rber" <[email protected]>; <[email protected]>
>Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 11:22 PM
>Subject: RE: Lack of Security

>At 10:55 PM 9/12/2001, Mathias K�rber wrote:
>>And thus reduce the number of people and bags etc that need to be checked,
>>which will allow for more time to do thorough checks.
>>Why is it important that non-passengers be able to get all the way to the


>The air marshall program is a good idea - I worry a little that a group of
>determined people could overpower him/her and end up in possession of their