North American Network Operators Group Date Prev | Date Next | Date Index | Thread Index | Author Index | Historical Re: Internet Backbone Index
I don't think I'm missing it. I think I'm disagreeing with it in as nice and nonconfrontational a way as I can given the crappy personality I have to work from. Splitting hairs from here to infinity on what "network" means and what the world wide web is departs rather widely from my mission here, so I'm giving it short shrift. If you don't know how ping and traceroute vary from data flows, I can't help much there either. If you want to draw a line of demarcation between a network and its performance, and a web server and its performance, you're free to do so. I just probably won't buy into it. On the actual concept that changing all the web servers will move the numbers: It might. It might not. I would probably bet at this point that there will be a lot of that going on among the non-moron crowd. I'm kind of hoping for it anyway. And then we'll see if the numbers move. My sense is that they will move some, and not as much as most seem to think. But it's true it could go the other way and be dramatic. I'm open to whatever results derive. Jack Rickard ---------- > From: Justin W. Newton <[email protected]> > To: Jack Rickard <[email protected]>; Stan Barber <[email protected]>; [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected] > Subject: Re: Internet Backbone Index > Date: Friday, June 27, 1997 2:50 PM > > > Jack, > I believe that you are missing the point that measuring web server > response time is /not/ the equivalent of measuring backbone performance. > > > At 12:45 PM 6/27/97 -0600, Jack Rickard wrote: > >They could be. The attempt is to factor that out. ALL measuring agents > >applied to ALL the backbones. And all contributed more or less equally to > >the end numbers. If a particular agent ran on a Commodore 64 with a kluged > >copy of KA9Q, and another agent ran on an Sun Solaris, both results would > >go into the result pile for all 29 measured networks. The net effect > >would be that the flaw would be in our "footprint" from which the > >measurements were taken. This footprint can only be a rough approximation > >of end user distribution anyway. It would affect absolute values relative > >to zero, but the relative indexes between networks should not be affected. > >Since we're looking at the relative relationship primarily, it wouldn't > >appear important. > > > > > >Jack Rickard > >---------- > >> From: Stan Barber <[email protected]> > >> To: Justin W. Newton <[email protected]>; Larry Vaden <[email protected]>; > >Sean Donelan <[email protected]>; [email protected] > >> Subject: Re: Internet Backbone Index > >> Date: Friday, June 27, 1997 1:54 PM > >> > >> Justin writes: > >> > ObAboutTopic: This is possibly the most flawed study on the planet. > >> > Remind me to get a fast web server. (And to think, we were going to > >put > >> > our web server in our office, behind a T-1, instead of in real estate > >near > >> > where the real bandwidth is that could be used for customers.). > >> > >> There are many studies more flawed. Consider some of the studies that > >> the Tobacco Institute has released over the years about the affects of > >> smoking. > >> > >> Concerning Internet performance, there have always been a variety of ways > >> of measuring it. It all depends on what you are really trying to measure. > >> The Keynote study is attempting to measure something to which the average > > > >> Internet user (not engineers) can relate. However, There are also > >clearly > >> the possibility of artifacts in the data because of the testing machine's > > > >> TCP stack or other issues (Vern Paxson has covered these issues at NANOG > >> and IETF meetings over the last few years). Checking their web site, > >their > >> software appears to run on top of the TCP stacks of many systems, so the > >> known artifacts of some of these platforms could be an issue. > >> > >> -- > >> Stan | Academ Consulting Services |internet: [email protected] > >> Olan | For more info on academ, see this |uucp: > >{mcsun|amdahl}!academ!sob > >> Barber | URL- http://www.academ.com/academ |Opinions expressed are only > >mine. > > > > > > ********************************************************* > Justin W. Newton voice: +1-415-482-2840 > Senior Network Architect fax: +1-415-482-2844 > PRIORI NETWORKS, INC. http://www.priori.net > Director At Large, ISP/C http://www.ispc.org > "The People You Know. The People You Trust." > *********************************************************
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